There is no Difference Between Digital Art and Digital Fashion Today
French businessman Sylvain Levy has created his own Metaverse to preserve the family art collection for the future
by Aida Dzhanhirova
There is no Difference Between Digital Art and Digital Fashion Today
Sylvain Levy has created his own Metaverse to preserve the family art collection for the future. Having extensive experience in digital transition, the French businessman shared with Cultural Singularity his vision of modern challenges, comparing the responsibility of private collections with the functions of state institutions regarding cultural heritage. With over 350 works, the Levy family manages their funds, constantly exploring innovative opportunities. This new model is worthy of study and can serve as a template for museums and other institutions.
The artspace in the Metaverse, DSLcollection x Aika Art Strategy
CS: You are a French businessman who has managed to understand contemporary art and has chosen a rather exotic direction for creating a family collection, of Chinese contemporary art. You, along with your entire family, have been successful in this endeavor and have gained authority. For example, if someone were to ask who the collector of Chinese art in France is, your name would be first mentioned. It's also wonderful that we're meeting at a time when, according to the last ART Basel and UBS Art Market Report 2024, the Chinese art market has taken second place in the world after the USA. You guessed the trend. What would you say about your choice many years ago – was it the intuition of an entrepreneur or someone who keeps their finger on the pulse of contemporary art?
SL: First thing, I thank you very much for this discussion today.
Coming back to your question on DSLcollection, I think, first, it’s important to say that we've been collecting for 40 years. The DSLcollection was another way for us to look at an old collection. Why do we focus on Chinese contemporary art? Because when we went to China in 2005, we were shocked to see what was happening there at that moment, in terms of the development of the cities, speed, and scale. We do believed that art is one of the parts of what society offers, and that is why we were seeking the energy in Chinese contemporary art. It’s important to say, that Chinese art, Chinese culture is a 3,000-year-old culture. Also, last, but not least point out that there are 1,4 billion people in China to find an artist, the task is not simple. The idea was to make a collection at that moment which could resonate with our time. And resonating with our time meant several things. First, it was 2005, the beginning of YouTube, so resonating with our time meant also to look at how we could use digital tools to share our collection. Resonating with our time was also to create a brand because a motion of branding was becoming very important at that moment. Resonating with our time meant also to bring fresh eyes into the collection, especially the eyes of the new generation, the eyes of our daughter.
So, this was the mission and the vision that we had in 2005 to focus on Chinese contemporary art, to resonate with our time, and to give a legacy to the collection from the eyes of someone who belongs to this generation.
Life made us to be encounters, you encounter something, someone, or a situation that inspires you… We were inspired by the new challenge of collecting, it was important, that we had a clear vision of what we wanted the collection to be, and how we wanted the collection to move in these very special times, in which we're living.
Zhang Yexing. HUNTING IN DREAMLAND-4, 303 x 300cm, Oil on canvas, 2014-2016, DSLcollection courtesy
CS: How do you position yourself, as a collector of physical art or digital one? What is the ratio of one to the other in your collection?
SL: It's a good question because I think it should be put into another type of context. First, you know, I was born, and I was living as homo sapiens at 100%. Now, I am “homo numericous”, especially because of computing, because of iPhones, and smartphones. I live a digital life now, like everyone. Digital has become a part of my real life now. It is not a virtual life yet.
And I am concerned that we may have problems because there are a lot of things that we're doing today, going through this new digital life. So, this is the context. If you want to resonate with your time, and you must do it, it means bringing this context to the collection.
Digital is a way to disseminate art. And you cannot avoid this kind today of having this attitude. What is the part of the physical or digital in the collection? There is no part. What is important is to address the right people with the right situation with the right tools at the right moment and to move freely as digitally as physically. What is more important today, is that is virtual, because we are moving not only through the digital world but also through the virtual world, it's very important today to be able to address physical, digital, and virtual.
CS: Thank you for a detailed explanation, sounds like the philosophy of your collection. I would like to return to the specifics of it. What are the peculiarities of interacting with Chinese artists? Do some of them live in France?
SL: People are interested in this connection. When we decided to create a collection of Chinese contemporary art, it was a big challenge for us. Because we lived in Paris, 8000 km from China, we did not speak the local language, and it was quite difficult. This is the first thing that I want to say because it's a totally different type of culture. The other thing, that was quite difficult was how to provide accessibility, how to address the question, having the differences of culture, and how to help the right people to help us to make a relevant collection.
Our first meetings were held in Paris with Chinese artists, living there. Later, we used the system, which is called in China as a “one-she system “for seeking artists. It means that we were recommending from one artist to another, and 40% of the collection was found in this way, by communication from one artist to another. The other way, we used to grow this collection, being in Paris, is to use WeChat. I looked through WeChat every day, it gave me the possibility to keep up with ongoing exhibitions in China, keep in touch with galleries and artists, and have access to artworks. The reality that was very important for us was this cultural part of the Chinese collection. We didn't want to make a collection through the eyes of the Western-looking at “Chineseness”. To avoid that, we spent a lot of time in China, we went there five times a year, my daughter and my son lived in China, and my brother still lives in China. Being there in different cities, was a way for us to better understand, what is behind Chinese contemporary art and culture. It was a time of luck and numerous encounters.
CS: Great experience! In the times of NFT hype, I had meetings with new kinds of collectors, which had appeared. Mostly, they did not know how many NFTs were in their collection, and they did not remember the author’s names or the titles of digital works also, except for the most well-known ones, such as Crypto Punks, of course. Usually, in this case of collecting, it is important to know the figure and the purchase amount for possible resale. And what about you? Do you know the names of the artists in your collection, their works, their sales histories, and exhibitions?
SL: I think that there are no good or bad collectors, good or bad ways to explain something. I think that art is becoming everything. Art is a luxury good, art is a financial asset, art is culture, art is a way to entertain yourself, art is a way to decorate your home, art is a way to experience other people, museums, etc. Art is becoming something very diffuse. And also, art as NFT. What does it mean for most of the people? Art NFT is mostly about the content in which theory is something called art, but it could be any other thing. Its content should relate to a type of community and, what is important in this community, is the motion of making money, and of crypto money, especially. So, the content of art inside, by itself, is not to be the core of this object. We collected two NFTs of Chinese artists, one from Liu Jiaying and the other from Yang Jiechang. But I am not convinced, that the art that is produced especially through crypto money, is something relevant for me, at this moment. Chinese artists are not using this new media as NFT, despite there being a lot of digital art in China. But one day, if it would be interesting for the DSLcollection, why not, it may be transformed into NFTs. So, we go step by step.
CS: Have you ever had a case in your practice where you could observe the creative and artistic growth of an artist whose works you had previously acquired?
I have a lot of such experiences. I may give you the names, of course. Art career is a very sensitive topic. Because it's becoming very difficult for an artist to build a career. Because artists are, more or less, like shooting stars. The history of art is very brutal, very few people remain. Artists move their careers differently, slower, or quicker. The important moment today is how the career is making, how you create your communication, especially how you use Instagram, another tool to make yourself visible to the community and collectors. And the importance is how you would manage yourself at the art market, especially at the secondary art market. In other words, it is not just to be skillful to make you last, it's much more difficult because of the competition, because of this time when things are super very quick in terms of being famous and also because of the new strategies that you have to apply to in terms of marketing and communication. What I may say, there is too much art for people, who collect.
CS: What role do emerging technologies play in the development and popularization of your collection? What new tasks do you solve with innovations?
SL: Well, once again, coming back to the core of the project. First, we wanted to resonate with our time. And, as I said to you, when we began this relationship in 2005, it was the beginning of YouTube, and so we felt that something new was happening with this Internet, and so we decided that YouTube was an emerging technology at that time, or emerging content, made a technology. We thought that it was a great way to look at how art can be disseminated through the Internet.
Later, it became mainstream, and different terms of emerging tools came. It was a Second life, it was the iPad, it was the virtual reality, it was the Metaverse, and it also artificial intelligence. So, once again, what is important? To serve on these various new tools and, as I said, very complementary. Tomorrow, perhaps, you will not use the computer anymore, we will be using special computing. So, you know what is important is always to be open, learn, and learn, and do what you can do.
The strategy that we're talking about with DSLcollection, with my wife Dominique and my daughter Karen is to follow the emerging technology.
CS: Tell us about new important projects in this direction.
SL: Well, one of the projects that strongly touches me. Being inspired by the successful opening of our space in China, we opened the space in Kyiv in 2021. We were obliged to stop it because of the war. The creation of the special space, in Sansar, our Metaverse platform, gave a new digital form of life to the project. Artists, who made their artwork for the project, created a part of new history. This virtual exhibition is timeless, it will be accessible even in 5-10 years. Thus, by doing the Metaverse, we create new possibilities for the future. I see the same role of the Metaverse in the DSLcollection.
CS: Your experience in terms of experimenting with the Metaverse for your collection is very important. I think you are creating a kind of system, a new language of art presentation. In the future, it can be used by museums, for example, by other institutions. What do you think about this?
SL: The problem with the art institutions is that, first, we still believe that object is more important than experience. We still believe that people go to museums to contemplate, that they don't take into account the fact that human beings have really changed, that they are homo-sapiens and homo-numerous as well. The number of visitors is still a success rate for museums, which are focused on involving people to experience by their, museums’ rules. For me, it is not the game of our time. This is my first reaction. How can I bring them to look at our time, when they are not willing for this? The problem is here. This is connected, first, with the consciousness of people who work in museums and cultural institutions.
The other thing is a bureaucratic system. When you discuss some innovative projects with the art institutional world, especially museums, the decision is taken by many different types of people, from a director to his deputy, a lawyer, a PR manager, etc. And all of them have different opinions. To convince these people, you spend a lot of your time and energy. But usually, the proposed project is rejected by the institution, because it is not ready for new communication.
I don’t feel that it is a part of my mission. Another situation is in private collections because they are in the hands of people who are businessmen. They are reluctant to bring digital experiences into their journey to support their status as contemporary collectors. Especially, by using digital tools, e-commerce, by luxury industry, by caring for artists.
What is interesting, private collections have the same rules and attitudes as traditional institutions have. But private collectors are more related to the times we live in. I should say that namely, private institutions are more respective in that sense.
CS: We live in times when we can't keep up with changes in interaction, value systems, the digital economy, etc. Speaking of art, how do you think the market is evolving? The traditional art system is huge, how ready is it to adapt to the modern challenges of the digital world?
SL: If we speak about contemporary art today, I think it's important to speak about what it means today, to be an artist. You must be recognized as an artist in the art community, and the whole ecosystem, and you must not be an entrepreneur. Another question is your educational background. A doctor must be educated, to have the license. An artist, contrary, may not have a graduation today. I don’t know what it is to be an artist today. You need to know a lot, to feel life, you have to be curious about the way you move around your life.
If to return to the institutional world, I may give you a few examples.
Museum of Contemporary Art, Los Angeles, transforms their space with the support of the US government with 700 million dollars. And nothing was invested in creating a digital space. I am sure, that even 2 million dollars would be enough to design a virtual space, solving the problems of a number of visitors and providing new ways of museum experience. Contrary, there was the show in China, which was streaming at that moment. It gave 128 million visitors. Seven British museums have a total year attendance of about 40 million. The advantage of digital implementation is obvious.
Another example. Two billion people play video games, and this direction must be discovered to delve into. You need to go inside, and open new resources for our communication and our life, to create digital twins for museums. You need to be ready for the moment when digital screens will appear for mass adoption. I see the problem that when this happens, it can be too late because it will be a virtual world already.
But you see, fashion and more a digital fashion, it's more successful in its way. Roblox and Sandbox are promoting some new fashions in their space. I see the ultimate actuality of art today. Once again, looking at the biggest fashion brands, such as Prada, LVMH, Cartier… Who is the biggest? People around the art or luxury brands? These brands are public, and they are also connected with art. They want to connect with their audience with the right message which is to bring art content into their own experiences. My opinion is that there is no difference between digital art and digital fashion today. It has finished.
The artspace in the Metaverse, DSLcollection x Aika Art Strategy
CS: The new generation of art collectors is significantly younger than their predecessors. What explains this?
SL: I think, there is a transformation of the young market. First, the part of online sales has grown very quickly, and it has grown because Generation Z, especially, is connected through art very critical online experiences. For them, the expenses are around 5,000 euros, a maximum of 10,000 euros, a very small amount of the project. They want to have something that resonates with their time. And what about the long-term collection for the future? It’s about flipping the flavor of the day. It's about the social way to be connected with other people in terms of what art is, it’s not at all which an object is important for them, but what the object brings to them. They don't care about the history of Art. It's not their problem. They are much more interested in how the artist is moving and staring on Instagram.
For them, it doesn't matter the questions of the future or the heritage.
Jia Aili. OUR CENTURY, 2007-2011, Oil on canvas- 1500cmx600cm, DSLcollection courtesy
CS: I would like to finish with a question about the future because all media speak about the future, digital technologies, innovation, new ways of life, new ways of communication, new ways of vision, etc.
What are the features of a collector in the future?
SL: You cannot tell what will happen before the end of this year in terms of politics, sociology, in terms of economy. So, what does it mean to look at the future? But mainly, what is important is today. It's another state of mind. It's to be a human. It's to adapt yourself, to push the boundaries, to be curious, to look at things in a relevant way. That's the way to move into the future. But for me, the future is also my life.